It is currently October 4th, 2024, 8:35 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]





 [ 7 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: August 18th, 2024, 5:02 pm 
Donor
MicroJacksonMA won a Tournament 2 times.

Joined: June 27th, 2017, 10:44 pm
Posts: 256
Location: California
Starcraft II Gateway: United States
Most elites are pretty well designed and are useful in some scenarios but some stick out like sore thumbs.

The first elite that needs the most attention is mini thor the problems with this unit arises from it being slow, expensive and its only ability has an extremely long charge up time and doesn't even do that much damage even if it does land. I would suggest reworking the ability or at the bare minimum allow mini thor to just barrage an area as is but allow it to still be able to continue auto attacking and moving while doing so. I also think that mini thor should have no splash damage against air but instead have a long ranged single target AA attack allowing it to be used to snipe warp prisms or medivacs nothing to crazy but right now it is the worst elite in all aspects.

Next the battlecruiser which is an age-old pub smashing machine is another weak elite this is due to the various ways to outplay yamato cannon. Basic splitting can counter its main ability aswell as warp prims or medivac pick ups making it unrealistic to get it off versus most half decent players. Not to mention 2 hero openers pretty much negate this abilities use what so ever (commando and tassadar) and a third hero (infestor) directly benefits from a battlecruiser being on the map. On top of this ghosts can disable it from using abilities and kill it with only a few attack upgrades. I would suggest either reworking the yamato making it not cost energy or giving it a greater range to initiate the cast from or keeping yamato as is but making it so the repair ability has some sort of spell reduction when pressed making it more tanky.

The final elite I want to bring to life is the oracle firstly I think the oracle has a lot of utility so buffing it to hard is not necessary but I would like to see a potential buff to allow opening them viable. Firstly they are very squishy but only have a 5.5 attack range with the upgrade this is equivalent to most mercenaries with the trainings meaning they will get popped the second they engage. My suggestion would be to allow players to purchase 3 instead of 2 and make it so the upgrade in the cc increases their range by 2. This would allow for them to have some sort of feeding capabilities early game while keeping them very micro intensive because of how squishy they are.

Some side notes perhaps tanks were nerfed a bit too harshly I think the moving while attacking was a key part of what made them viable. Reapers are still too strong perhaps bringing their cost back up to 200 is needed.

Thanks for reading hopefully we can see these elites become more viable.


Report this post
Top
       
 
PostPosted: August 19th, 2024, 8:37 am 
Donor
[EsYPsY] sexy.121
SeexySauce won a Tournament 3 times.

Joined: March 31st, 2014, 3:25 pm
Posts: 522
Starcraft II Gateway: United States
All of these make sense if everything in here was just a patch it would be a great patch. Would also recommend taking a look at early game lancers as they seem a big strong.


Report this post
Top
       
 
PostPosted: August 19th, 2024, 11:56 am 
ModeratorMap DeveloperBeta TesterDonor
[TryHrd] Akash.566
Map Editor
User avatar

Joined: August 8th, 2014, 1:14 pm
Posts: 569
Starcraft II Gateway: United States
Minithor, BC, and tank are the only 3 elites which have no function other than directly dealing damage (duskwings is arguably in this category as well). These 3 elites suffer from poor, one-dimensional unit design - buffing their damage-dealing ability would only serve to exacerbate the issue. Imo a unit that exists only to deal damage would be classified as a hero. Yamato is a high-damage AOE spell that also has high single-target damage - if yamato is able to land often (as it does against inexperienced players), then BC cannot be called anything other than a hero.

I'm not against changing these elites to be more viable, but it has to be in some way other than buffing their ability to deal damage. For example, maybe BC could give an armor aura? Just a random example, but something that helps your own army or hinders the enemy army without directly dealing damage.

Oracle range buff I'm more ok with as a quality-of-life change to prevent it from going too far in front of your army if you have it in the same control group. However, I could see it becoming an incredibly annoying unit to deal with (thinking pre-nerf duskwings) if it deals too much damage while maintaining its high movement speed.

Reaper cost nerf makes sense.


Report this post
Top
        
 
PostPosted: August 19th, 2024, 3:40 pm 
Donor
MicroJacksonMA won a Tournament 2 times.

Joined: June 27th, 2017, 10:44 pm
Posts: 256
Location: California
Starcraft II Gateway: United States
     Akash wrote:
Minithor, BC, and tank are the only 3 elites which have no function other than directly dealing damage (duskwings is arguably in this category as well). These 3 elites suffer from poor, one-dimensional unit design - buffing their damage-dealing ability would only serve to exacerbate the issue. Imo a unit that exists only to deal damage would be classified as a hero. Yamato is a high-damage AOE spell that also has high single-target damage - if yamato is able to land often (as it does against inexperienced players), then BC cannot be called anything other than a hero.

I'm not against changing these elites to be more viable, but it has to be in some way other than buffing their ability to deal damage. For example, maybe BC could give an armor aura? Just a random example, but something that helps your own army or hinders the enemy army without directly dealing damage.

Oracle range buff I'm more ok with as a quality-of-life change to prevent it from going too far in front of your army if you have it in the same control group. However, I could see it becoming an incredibly annoying unit to deal with (thinking pre-nerf duskwings) if it deals too much damage while maintaining its high movement speed.

Reaper cost nerf makes sense.


I would argue that a lot of elites have no function besides dealing damage tanks, reapers, vikings etc... I don't think that every elite should be aura based either imo warp prism, medivac and sentry although are support elites take very minimal skill to use and give a greater benefit than most of these pure damage elites. I personally don't want all elites to be this low skill and big impact style and and prefer having a variety of both types.

As for oracle I don't think this change would make it that annoying they have significantly less health than duskwings and probably less dps.


Report this post
Top
       
 
PostPosted: August 19th, 2024, 10:54 pm 
ModeratorMap DeveloperBeta TesterDonor
[TryHrd] Akash.566
Map Editor
User avatar

Joined: August 8th, 2014, 1:14 pm
Posts: 569
Starcraft II Gateway: United States
Reapers at least have flashbang, vikings I'd argue are more zoning in air mode since they don't really kill air units as fast as corruptors do (but I agree their ground mode is pure damage, which I dislike). Agreed that we don't need more auras, was just a random example. Maybe tactical jump could be interesting for BC?

If we're talking low-skill elites, I don't think it gets any lower-skill than a-moving tanks to deal massive damage+splash (at least players do have to a-move now if they want the tanks to attack) - can even ignore the concave and still win trades early :C


Report this post
Top
        
 
PostPosted: August 19th, 2024, 11:43 pm 
Donor
MicroJacksonMA won a Tournament 2 times.

Joined: June 27th, 2017, 10:44 pm
Posts: 256
Location: California
Starcraft II Gateway: United States
     Akash wrote:
Reapers at least have flashbang, vikings I'd argue are more zoning in air mode since they don't really kill air units as fast as corruptors do (but I agree their ground mode is pure damage, which I dislike). Agreed that we don't need more auras, was just a random example. Maybe tactical jump could be interesting for BC?

If we're talking low-skill elites, I don't think it gets any lower-skill than a-moving tanks to deal massive damage+splash (at least players do have to a-move now if they want the tanks to attack) - can even ignore the concave and still win trades early :C


Kiting back with tanks and targeting firing to get maximum value out of the splash damage they do is APM taxing if anything the new tanks are as you described. I do agree old tanks were a bit too strong which is why I think reducing their HP by a bit would balance them.


Report this post
Top
       
 
PostPosted: August 22nd, 2024, 9:25 pm 
Donor
[EsYPsY] sexy.121
SeexySauce won a Tournament 3 times.

Joined: March 31st, 2014, 3:25 pm
Posts: 522
Starcraft II Gateway: United States
I agree with micro, sound points.


Report this post
Top
       
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 [ 7 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group